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Go Back   FZ1OA Message Board > FZ1 & Fazer Owners Association > Purchasing, Insurance, & Warranty

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Old 01-17-2005, 05:28 PM   #21
70super
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From the first post

Quote:
2004 FZ1
List Price: $8699 (Raven/Liquid Silver)
List Price: $8599 (Team Yamaha Blue)
I believe this is what I've seen in the mags as well.
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Old 01-17-2005, 05:36 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally posted by 70super
From the first post



I believe this is what I've seen in the mags as well.

Sorry...i saw those but hoped somebody had the 2005 prices...as that is what i quoted in Canadian dollars.

we are $11,999 here full msrp for a 2005.
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Old 01-17-2005, 07:53 PM   #23
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If dealers cost on an fz1 is $7200, as per our privy info, then there making 15% if it was sold for the full MSRP of $8500. So after paying commisions to the sales person plus operating expenses that leaves them with about 67$.

Right!
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Old 01-17-2005, 08:11 PM   #24
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Originally posted by bqe
If dealers cost on an fz1 is $7200, as per our privy info, then there making 15% if it was sold for the full MSRP of $8500. So after paying commisions to the sales person plus operating expenses that leaves them with about 67$.

Right!

Can i get a job there selling bikes

Sweet commission cheques Batman
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Old 01-17-2005, 08:15 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by bqe
If dealers cost on an fz1 is $7200, as per our privy info, then there making 15% if it was sold for the full MSRP of $8500. So after paying commisions to the sales person plus operating expenses that leaves them with about 67$.

Right!
Do you actually think their is a conspiracy here? If there was don't you think the secret would have got out by now. There probably is thousands of bike dealerships across the US. Each dealership has at a few people that are privy to the bottom line. So what you're saying is there are thousands of people out there who are taking a secret vow to the grave with them.

The actual cost to Yamaha is probably quite a bit lower than $7200. Yamaha can do this because they have limited worldwide competition.

One of my wholesalers went through a Delta Faucet factory on a tour. He said a certain faucet cost Delta $3.50 to make (material and labor). They sell that same faucet wholesale at close to $70. A lot of people step on it to get to $70.

I'm sure it's the same with the bikes. I'm sure there are quite a few steps from factory to showroom floor.
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Old 01-17-2005, 08:34 PM   #26
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Don't forget if you sell lots of product you usually get a very big fat cheque also from the factory for selling their products.

I mean BIG cheques!!!!!!!!!!!!

Can you say hundreds of thousands of dollars at the end of the year.
So after you already made good money all year, and then say Honda throws you a bonus of another $200,000 or more its not exactly scraping by on pennies to survive.


Sure they tell you how hard it is, and they barely make anything...blah blah blah...its called sales

if you believe them well then they got you sucked in like every other person.

Buy a new set of forks say for your bike...what do you pay the dealer for a set?
now what do you think it actually cost to build them?

Answer....as i toured the Honda factory....forks cost at that time less than $30 per pair for Honda to build in Canadian dollars.
Parts person asked $560 per pair.

I buy fuel by the tanker load....i won't tell you how much the refinery makes, or you will be setting explosive charges around them to blow them up.

Since i own a Peterbilt, i need to buy parts for it.
As one of my best friends in the whole world works there i get my parts all at half price. And yup, you guessed it...they still make money off of me.

So keep thinking the poor dealer is near starvation...he will thank you from his class A cabin on the yearly Carribean cruise.
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Old 01-17-2005, 08:38 PM   #27
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I'm not crying conspiracy., just stating the facts. Most dealers rape their customers knowing that buying a bike is usually impulsive. Most buyers will pay MSRP plus freight, prep and whatever else they can get away with charging.

Some people pay "dealers cost". Why would a dealer sell a bike at cost,, were they just trying to get there foot in the door or making space for the new bikes to arrive?

Bullshit!

Dealers make more money than contractors and photographers, combined.

That's cool with me, everybody's got the right to make a living even if its close to 35% of MSRP.
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Old 01-17-2005, 08:53 PM   #28
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Exactly.

I like how they charge freight etc.
Hello

I would like to see any other business have in stock something to sell, and then also try a paper work fee, a shipping charge , and assembly charge etc on top of an already high price.

next time you go buy batteries for your flashlight, and they want an extra $5 for shipping, and a $100 paper work fee, and a $5 shelf stocking fee...feel free to pay it

Oh and a recycling fee of $5 per battery they charge you as a levy Yup they do that here...I am not kiding.

You would never buy batteries again would you?
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Old 01-17-2005, 09:40 PM   #29
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Likewise, if the real cost of an FZ was $5500, someone would be selling them for $6500 and making all of the sales

Why would they sell bikes for $6500 when they can easily sell them for $7200 all day, that's the cost isnt it?


I guess knowing what the real Actual cost of a bike is hurts, it even makes some people mad.. mad enough to ignore the logical truth of the matter...u got ripped!! and it drips

Last edited by bqe; 01-18-2005 at 06:01 AM.
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Old 01-27-2005, 02:45 PM   #30
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You don't get ripped, just because a guy makes a good margin doesn't mean it a rip off.

If they can move all the FZ's they can handle at $7200 your not gonna get one for less. Why sell one for less when the next guy in the door will pay more?

It's not a rip off to pay the going price, if the product doesn't sell at that price they will drop it. Business charges what the market ie: you, will bear.
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Old 01-29-2005, 10:34 PM   #31
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Originally posted by WAB
So if your photographer gives you a discount, do not think he is a hero...he is still making buckets of money off of you,,,especially weddings...why oh why do people waste so much on wedding pics.
cause no one would work weddings unless they were getting paid shit-loads.

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Old 04-24-2005, 04:15 AM   #32
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I sell Yamaha motorcycles. There is no conspiracy, there is no huge markup on new bikes. There isnt anything complicated about this.

A dealer makes decent money on used bikes, great money on parts, a little on service, and a little on new bike sales.

I know what my store pays for a new FZ1 from Yamaha and there isnt much markup. We dont make a few thousand dollars on this bike like some people would like to believe.
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Old 04-24-2005, 05:07 AM   #33
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Sure you don't squid killer,

Whatever, I saw a blue fz1 leftover in Peoria, Il last year or maybe two years ago for 6495 leftover but brand new.

Same story in the lawnmower business.

Cousin owns a snapper shop. part that he paid 17 dollars for , sold for$79
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Old 04-24-2005, 07:22 AM   #34
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I don't really want to play with this particular can of worms, but if I have any expertise in anything, it's in this area. So in the interest of shedding any light I have, here goes.

I sold bikes to dealers in my last "real job". Prior to working for that OE mfg, most of my adult life was spent selling them to you guys and managing dealerships. What Squid killer said is accurate. Maybe there "is" some conspiracy between the dealership owners and the top level OE muckety mucks to keep mid level management in the dark, but his statement is the truth as I know it.

Probably the only reason you can even find an FZ1, Katana or any of the other slow sellers on the dealership floor is the OE's tactics at the dealer meetings. This is where the OE's tell the dealer what their allocation by model is for the year and take orders. If the dealer wants all the bennies, he has to take full allocation. I doubt three dealerships in the country would order a single FZ1 if it weren't for these inducements. This is where those year end hold backs, free flooring, advertising dollars etc. are used to move inventory out of the OE's warehouse and into the dealers showrooms.

This board is full of posts where people bought their new FZ1 at a great price. Lots of them had been sitting on the dealers floor for over a year. Great bike, I agree. But it really only appeals to us wiser hipper types and we are an elite and very small segment of the buying public.

The "kill ratio" for the magazine bike de jour is manyfold more and they move briskly from the floor at full pop retail. These are the bikes the dealers want more of than the mfgs will give them. They sell before they come off free flooring and the dealer has to either pay cash or pay a monthly finance charge, based on prime, to keep those that languish. Free flooring is very important to a dealer.

Flooring charges account for a huge amount of the monthly nut for keeping the doors open. Trust me, ya want to get a dealers blood pressure up? Engage him in a conversation about his flooring charges. Every franchise has more slow movers than out the door flyers. Make top dollar on one model and sell five others at a discount.

To keep from this becoming a novel length diatribe on managing a dealership, lets move back to that FZ1 on the dealers floor. If it sold within the first three months (normal length of free flooring) at full retail, the dealer takes in about 12 to 15% when you sign the papers. His costs deducted from the sale are transporting the crated bike form the distribution point to his store, uncrating and assembly, servicing and the sales, accounting, licensing/tagging and finance staffs cuts.

Most dealers do add shipping and handling charges to cover all but the sales costs, so we can theoretically throw out those other costs. This model provides a reasonable margin. It is augmented at years end with advertising co-op dollars and year end hold back checks. Again, Squid Killers example of three percent of "dealer cost" is about right.

But now lets take a more typical FZ1 sale. It's far more likely that this bike has sat on the floor past its free flooring period. A good flooring rate for a dealer is about 1 over prime for the amount paid to Yamaha. Each month it has sat there reduces the margin and adds to the overhead, Believe me, it adds up...fast! Further, spiffs on slow movers are usually given to a salesman that moves it out the door and stops this cash hemoraging. This further reduces the profit after cost of sale calculation.

So your right. They probably threw a party when you bought your FZ1 or any other slow mover on the floor.

There are dealer incintives to take non current models out of the OE's warehouse. Depending on the number the mfg is sitting on, these can be substantial. This info can be used to your advantage when shopping for a new bike. Especially if, like the Fizzie, there have been no changes except bold new graphics from year to year.

Now, why do OE's continue to produce these slow movers that they have to continually black mail dealers into stocking?.... Told you this could turn into a novel

In case your marveling at the length I have gone on, it's snowing! 70's and clear blue skies for the last week and now today, the traditional meet for breakfast and rip around the mountains day of the week...this shit! Oh well, AMA and WSBK on Speed starting at 1PM.
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Old 04-24-2005, 04:34 PM   #35
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Originally posted by ldup
Sure you don't squid killer,

Whatever, I saw a blue fz1 leftover in Peoria, Il last year or maybe two years ago for 6495 leftover but brand new.

Same story in the lawnmower business.

Cousin owns a snapper shop. part that he paid 17 dollars for , sold for$79

And your an expert on the motorcycle industry because of that?
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Old 04-24-2005, 05:44 PM   #36
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Gravityfiend, thanks for the insight. Personally I'm curious about the economics of low volume models like the FZ1. Or the new '03 SV1000 naked I was ogling on a dealer's floor recently. I guess the SV1000 didn't make the economic cut and the FZ1 does... by how much?

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Old 04-24-2005, 05:46 PM   #37
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Quote:
Originally posted by ldup
Sure you don't squid killer,

Whatever, I saw a blue fz1 leftover in Peoria, Il last year or maybe two years ago for 6495 leftover but brand new.

Same story in the lawnmower business.

Cousin owns a snapper shop. part that he paid 17 dollars for , sold for$79
parts are another story............
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Old 04-24-2005, 06:55 PM   #38
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I am indeed the world's foremost leading expert ... in my on opinion. Even if its ignorant.
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Old 04-24-2005, 08:53 PM   #39
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I am indeed the world's foremost leading expert ... in my on opinion. Even if its ignorant.

Fair enough.
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Old 04-25-2005, 04:46 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally posted by swerverite
Gravityfiend, thanks for the insight. Personally I'm curious about the economics of low volume models like the FZ1. Or the new '03 SV1000 naked I was ogling on a dealer's floor recently. I guess the SV1000 didn't make the economic cut and the FZ1 does... by how much?

swerverite
" I guess the SV1000 didn't make the economic cut and the FZ1 does... by how much?"

Rephrase your question so that I can understand exactly what you want me to address, please. I'm more than happy to answer but don't think too many others would enjoy a litany on what, to them, must be a boring subject.
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